i ride mini bikes do they have a thread on mini bike rules?

 

Define pitbike and mini what's the difference just wheel size or more?

 

I did not read the entire thread on the other site as I got bored real fast there. My opinion only, as I too, have and have owned a few, old school minibikes..

Minibikes or Mini Bikes which ever you prefer, have very significant differences than Pitbikes.

Minibikes have horizontal engines (lawnmower) and have no spokes on the 6" wheels and 12" tires for example. True both Pitbikes and Minibikes can have centrifugal clutches.

Pitbikes (minicycles as we call them, in the minibike world) evolved from go-karts and minibikes) In 1958 or so, go-karts were just coming to be. Minibikes came a bit later I believe. Never was the term "pitbike" used in the 1960s, that I am aware of. Pitbikes have spokes, smaller wheels than their counterparts motorcycles and are primarily used for cruising the pits looking at girls..Racing bikes (pitbikes) are a totally different story. They are used to race at outdoor and indoor tracks as purpose built machines, for racing and were not created, for cruising and just looking at girls..

Let's get it right. If I am wrong? Kindly correct me as this is one Man's opinion only...

TTXR Out~~

This was a fun post.....

 

Well the reason that thread basically started was because the rule around here for a long time has always been a 12" stock and 12" open class at fair races as well as some other local tracks. As for the 12" open class is has always been max 12" rear wheel and some places will have a 14" rear wheel trailbike class. As for the arguments started when a kid tried to race a klx140 in the 12" open pitbike race and it started alot of controversy and arguments. As i stated before i dont think it matters if it was a bone stock klx140 or not the bigger wheel size helps out tremoundously. And people will sit there and argue how my bbr has way more horsepower and what not over a klx140 or ttr125 but i found that to be not true. You put a fast A class rider on a 14" stock bike he will keep up with the modded 12" bikes. So my theory was if people are going to try and run these 14" bikes in 12" class before we know it people will be trying to run 150rs in the 12" class lol.

 

WELL said...

 

In case you guys fall asleep before ya get to my version of what the rules SHOULD be. I copied and pasted them so you can read them right here. Bear in mind that I ride a big 'ol Trail bike. I'm not the kid that whooped everybody on the KLX140 though. I'm a +40 Vet Class rider. I do like to show up and ride/race though. It's fun, and it helps keep the scene afloat-- that's what we all have to keep in mind here.

In the serious bigger races, and money races, I agree with Justin. 12 inch, open cradle, etc... I agree that a 150R is way too much bike in the pit bike races. We differ when it comes to letting the bigger bikes into random races where there aren't alot of classes, and alot of dis-similar bike types all get lumped together.

The race in question had 9 entries. It was actually called OPEN pit bike. There were 6 12 inch Mod bikes, two CRF150F's (one being me), and a lightning fast kid on a close to stock KLX140L. I got 6th, the other 150F got 8th, and the kid on the 140L won, which isn't suprising because the kid is a local A rider.

Now-- I agree that the bigger wheels are definitely an advantage, but more or less on big bike tracks with big bumps and ruts. Not so much on the perfectly groomed track we ran that night. Also-- I can assure you that the big trail bikes don't have more than 12 horse stock (I know that the two 150F's were bone stock. Not sure about the 140L). BUT! They weigh 220-240 lbs! I know alot of the mod 110's are doing 15-20 horse, and weigh half that.

Also-- I'm not trying to start another what IS or ISN'T a pit bike war again on here. I'm buds with Justin for sure. We're just discussing in an intelligent fashion a topic of pit bike rules here. We have to keep the rules (if there were any) in line with what bikes are readily available, and what the current trends are in our sport/hobby. We can't do what we did in 2005, b/c the scene is changing and evolving. The bigger trail bikes are becoming really popular in our region (Ohio) b/c they're everywhere for sale, cheap, fun to ride, super reliable, and they don't need $5000 into them to be raceable. It only makes sense to run them-- no?

Well- here are the rules as Mr. Luckystar would have them. Lemme know what ya think.

Stock 10-- No engine mods, Chassis mods limited to tall seat, bars, shock, fork internals. Pipe allowed on 50cc bikes. 70cc must run stock exhuast.

Open 10-- Anything goes.

Stock 12-- No engine mods, stock pipe. Chassis mods limited to tall seat, bars, shock, fork internals. 4th gear drums allowed on pre '10 KLX110's. (Every manufacturer but Suzuki has a 110 now!)

Open 12-- Anything goes.

Stock 16-- No mods other than shock, and fork internals. (Maybe let the 125's have pipes, but no pipes for KLX140's or CRF150F's? Just to try and get some parity for the displacement advantage of the 140 ind 150F? The 150 is one heavy beast though! Let XR100's go to 120cc's and run a pipe?)

Open 16-- Anything goes. NO 150R's.

Vet-- +40, Stock 16 rules.

Youth-- 12 and under. Stock 10 and Stock 12 bikes only.

 

its just getting way to complicated for to turn up with your bike and race these day and its due to too many bike variations
look how simple it is at motocross races 50cc class, 65cc class, 85cc class, 250cc class and 450cc class, then it just comes
down to rider skill level, beginner, novice, intermediate, expert and pro. pretty simple
bike with the mini bikes everyone modding the crap out of bikes that do not belong in the mini scene like the crf150R its a school
boy motocross bike just cos someone puts a 12" wheel on the rear does not make it a mini bike if you want to race a crf150r you
need to enter the 85cc motocross class
if you want to race in the 10" class buy a xr/crf50 dont put 10" wheels on a klx110, if you want to own a klx110 theres a 12" class
for that bike.

 

Very well said everyone. the 10" and 12" are true pitbikes in my eyes but where I'm from central Illinois everyone I mean everyone except myself, friend and brother all ride those damn playbikes (ttr125, crf100 CRf150f klx140s) they do do have a big advantage even bone stock with the bigger wheels but it all comes down to just trying to whip there ass on my 12" cause if we regulated it here there would be no pitbike racing which is slim as it is. So i just try and take it as it is and get faster. Great thread though! I feel for all the true pitbike racers!!!

 

I started the thread and I apologize for calling them "pitbikes" and not "minis" I was not aware of that being an offensive term! Much like 'rat rod' instead of 'traditional hot rod' I suppose. The local races refer to the class as "pitbikes". My thoughts were just what was being discussed here. Before buying or building a mini, I was watching the local races and thought it was strange that they allowed trail bikes to compete with the minis. Just didn't seem right as others have stated. The only restriction anybody can tell me is no larger than 143 cc. Someone suggested wheel base, but I cannot find a rule (the local race sign up lady couldn't tell me!) supporting that argument.

D-

 

Check the vegas mini moto website they have full set of rules they go by and believe they go by wheel size, wheelbase vertical air cooled open cradle frame 188cc max.... But plz don't quote me on that! But it is the true mini race so good rules to go by

 

it's pretty simple. 12" bikes run in a class with 12" bikes. 10", 14" and so on. No reason a fukn 14" klx140 or crf150f should be riding with anything but those bikes. When your next to one of those on a 110 it's a huge size difference.

 

Really what it comes down to, is that it's fine if all the bikes run together at a race that has time constrictions. The two classes of bikes just needed to be scored seperately is all. The promoters don't understand the difference between the bikes. In reality-- we should be glad they let us race at all. Pit bikes as a whole needs every rider, and every style of bike to be successful and grow. I'm telling the newer pit bike guys that this complaining about everything is the crap that almost killed the scene in 2008. It shouldn't be this serious. --L*64

 

It is not that simple. That is the point. The local track people run anything 4 stroke (trail bike AND mini's) in one class, TTR 125, KLX 140 until a DQ (another story) Modded out 110's, crf50 with big bars and a tall seat, etc. I had NO idea there was this much confusion out here in Ohio. Maybe in FLA, CA or Vegas the 'rules' are followed, but whatever the 'rules' are, they don't seem to be followed here as long as the displacement does not exceed 143 cc. With out a tear down, how do they patrol that?! Trying to make heads and tales, that is all.

 

i do understand if your local motocross race club is putting on a mini race and to get a full gate they have to let the trail bikes so it make it worth while but with some organizing you should be able to get people to commit to fair racing by everyone getting 50s or 110s that are proper minis

 

And here I thought AHRMA rules were a PITA.

 

need to stay close to the rules that vegas ,2up and masters of mini use ,, make it simple and fair so everyone has a good time ,, thats what has worked for us , 2up

 

Guys, guys, guys.... I understand and agree with you. If it IS a pit bike event, then they DO seperate the classes around here. This was a big bike (County Fair race) event that doesn't have pit bikes within its' racing organization (CRA) at all. That's why the promoters have no idea what does or doesn't run with each other. They just add a few classes of pit bikes to the night of racing because they get about 50 racers who show up with pit bikes of sorts who want to race them. They have Stock, and Open Pitbike I think? If the bike isn't a Stock 50 or 110, then they threw it into Open. I understand what they did.

When I was at sign up, the lady was saying that they are borderline not even having pit bikes at all because there's always a ton of complaining regarding the rules. The pit bikes usually run at the end of the program-- (we raced at midnight this year!) and the scorekeepers are pretty much whipped by then. Then come the pit bike racers complaining about everything. It happens every year-- the Stock guys complain about who's bike isn't stock, the trail bikes, the 10 inch 110's... it's always something, and they don't understand it, and they don't want to hear it.

So-- if we want to keep a good thing going. We gotta keep the complaints to a minimum, or we aren't going to be racing there at all. It happened at the Ram Jam series a few years back. The promoters got tired of the complaining at every event, so they went from holding races, to having ride nights. When that didn't bring in the riders like the races did-- they pulled the plug on the pit bikes altogether. If you go on You Tube-- you'll see how many racers they had there at one time. Believe me-- I've been on the scene since 2001. It's best to just go with the flow, ride, race, and have fun. The rules have never been fair. --L*64

 

I dont see what the big problem is with the bigger minis in open class first of all the 140 only won because the guy in the lead riding the wholesale bike ripped off a footpeg with like three laps to go... and 140 or full mod he was an A class rider he would fast on anything. also i dont think that the bigger tire is going to make that much of a difference, on monday me and luckystar raced each other he was on his 150 and i was on my stock mod 110 and we were pretty equally matched. its not the bike that is giving anyone an unfair advantage in my opinion its rider skill

 

put me on luckystars 150 and u on your stock mod well see how close it is lol , like you said i know it has to do with rider skill but thats besides the point here. At medina that klx140 was pulling on me outta the corners and ive got a fully built 178 motor. Obviously they should have a 14" class but they dont have the time for that at local fairs. Them racing there 150s and 140s is like me racing my full mod in stock mod , u guys wouldnt be to happy ....

 

ya you would probably whoop on me but then if i was on his bike and you were on mine you would still beat me cuz your a better rider. thats my point its rider skill not the bike. maybe the 140 has more power then I thought but it can't be that much of an advantage to your 178. Someone needs to court have a strait drag race to settle this argument

 

Its not the power... its the the added length, the bigger wheels, the ability to roll through corners and over obstacles easier/faster... its a much bigger/more comfortable/stable bike... PERIOD.

And Luckystar, ANY kind of racing is serious.... are you kidding me? We spend tons of hours/money into building race bikes and you expect it not to be serious??? Maybe back in the day when everyone rode stockers with bars it wasnt a big ordeal, but times have changed. I got 7k into my full mod and have to pay $30 dollars to race it.. your damn right Im taking it serious. I dont want to line up with guys that have ditched there full mods because they have gotten smoked in the past and have found an advantage on a bigger bike. Now Im sure thats not what happening with you, as it sounds like you really care for the sport and you're just trying to have a good time. But when pitbikes where big here, it happend. Certain people got tired of getting smoked, so they got 150r's, TTR125's (or whatever it is) etc. and started trying to race the pitbike class. These guys were NOT doing it just for the fun... they wanted an advantage to WIN. Now, would I bitch about a kid or someone just wanting to race and ride?? HELL no. No problem at all, but when you're on the line with 4 stock mods, 5 full mods, and a 140 (while the 140 has a full mod sitting at the trailor) and the 140 wins the race, thats B.S. in my book.

 

If it is a series that has classes, enforce the rules. BUT if it is like this where it is only a stock and open class(better than we have here in LA we only have an open class) then any bike that would have a class at some pitbike/mini race should be allowed to race. And for the 14/12 150r or bigger minis haters there is a class for that so i think it would be fair game.

And another thing is if you have a problem with the bike someone is racing talk the person with the bike before or after the race, dont complain to the promoters, they have enough to deal with as it is. I speak from experience because at a race i was at i raced a 14/12 150r and had a stock110 with me but the only time people said anything was when we were lined up, but we did that to people with full mod 110s too so how was i supposed to know the difference? What was i supposed to do, run and go get my 110 ready and probably miss the race? I brought the 110 only for the reason that i knew someone may have had a problem with me racing it and would have switched without a complaint yet instead they come on here and bad mouth me about it, not just that it was someone who WASNT EVEN AT THE RACE. I sold that bike and never raced it again.

 

I knew you'd troll your way in here. I also know that no matter what is said you wont ever shut up, so Ill just add (for the sake of this thread as well as all the others) That you were warned many times before you even got theat 150r home NOT to put 12/14 on it, and NOT to race it in the pit bike classes. I TOLD YOU I WOULD PROTEST YOU BEFORE YOU EVEN GOT THE BIKE HOME THE DAY YOU BOUGHT IT! And as written in the other threads, you constantly bashed me for riding an lxr, saying it was the same size and not fair and all this other mess... and what do you ride now? AN LXR!!! LOL! I knew this thread would come to this... Im out.

 

Did you even read my post? i was not bashing anyone, i was simply saying to talk to the person, which you did, props, but then you came on here and started a big debate. I want to let people know that if you talk the person without bashing them or being angry, they will most likely be reasonable and come up with a way to make peace. The only reason i felt that it would be ok was because EVERY other person i talked to said it was cool(ben, cogburn, etc well over 5 people), maybe they werent for it but they werent against it either. And the only reason i bought the lxr was the same reason i gut the 150r, i got a deal i couldnt pass up.

 

Hey guys-- great topic, but we're not here to get mad at all. Just to find a way to make it so ALL the bikes and riders can exist together w/o alot of complaints, hurt feelings, etc... hahaha!

Catastrophic-- you're a great rider bro! Don't sell yourself short. I'm a dirty old man who loves to ride cheap bikes is all. We're pretty even with you on a stock mod. If you were on Justin's ride-- I would get decimated on my 150F. So the real race would be to have Justin on my bike and you on his. Both of you are pretty equal as riders--- then it would be bike vs. bike.

I understand Justin's point. I don't think he's salty that we like to ride big trail bikes. I think he's salty b/c they didn't seperate the scoring at the "UN- Fair" race last month, and he kinda got screwed out of his placement because Logan K. won on the 140L. I get that. It's an easy fix-- just have the classes run together as always, but simply score them seperately. Problem solved. We can't add a class at the fair, b/c there isn't that kind of time. The thing isn't done until after midnight as it is. What was really dumb was that they let Logan into stock Mod on the 140. That's where the fact that the sign up people have no idea what they'r doing comes into play. I'd have been pissed if I got screwed on my stock mod, but our race was Open Pit Bike.

At bigger pit bike events-- we don't run together b/c there is time for all the races. We'll talk to the people before the next fair series to see if we can score the class seperately. I'd like to do it at Summit as well, b/c I'd like to race there, but there isn't any Vet or 16 Open Class there. --L*64

 

i think the point is if you want to race in the mini bike races get a mini bike that fits in that mini class
if you ride a trail bike go ride the trails and if you ride a MX bike go race MX

 

I'm from LA as well, and have ridden with Mr.Skywalker for 4-5 years now. I don't think he intentionally tried to bother anyone with his 150r, he's not a guy that would do so. Special K, I see where you stand as well and I respect your opinion just as I think you would respect mine. I think if there were enough classes to seperate and more people to ride there would not have been an issue. I think that everyone should just respectfully figure out the classes (somewhat like the EPIC series had) and if something is not supposed to be there let the people in charge handle it. I am NOT trying to continue a pissing match because I have respect for all riders and love the mini scene more than any other type of Moto sports. So for the sake of the LA mini scene, please just move on and be civil, and let's get the scene back to where it was. I really believe that with some motivation the scene here could be EVEN BIGGER than it has ever been. I know TONS of people that have pit bikes and would love to make events like we had in the past. The biggest problem is just that the LA scene has really fallen apart which makes it hard to put the right classes into the events.

If I was holding a decent sized event I would have the following classes:

10" stock - Beginner, Intermediate, Money
10" stock/mod - Beginner, Intermediate, Money
10" mod - Beginner, Intermediate, Money

12" stock - Beginner, Intermediate, Money
12" stock/mod - Beginner, Intermediate, Money
12" mod - Beginner, Intermediate, Money

10 & 12" trail bikes, stock & mod - Beginner, Intermediate, Money
14" trail bikes, stock - Beginner, Intermediate, Money
14" trail bikes, mod - Beginner, Intermediate, Money

Anyone sandbagging would get bumped a class higher.

Also, I have no beef with anyone about any classes or anything. I'm just glad there are ANY mini races still around and hope that the scene grows once again!

- James

 

If I was holding a decent sized event I would have the following classes:

I guess this is where this thread gets tricky, as it was started based on one race some where else and has now shifted to whats happening/has happened here in LA. The thing is, there ARE no classes here. There are no pit bike races here. There isnt enough riders to split classes. We are lucky to get ONE open pit bike class at the big bike races, and up until last year everyone followed the 12" rule. Yes, there were 10"s in the mix, but EVERYONE stuck to the 12" and under rule. There were no water cooled bikes, no closed framed bikes, etc. etc. When those guys started bringing in the "non-pit bikes" to the line to race, others followed. Why buy a 10" bike to race when you could race a 12" bike? But then, why buy a 12" bike to race when you could buy a 150r and put small wheels on it? And even then, why do all that, when you can just by a 140 (bigger bike) or whatever and race that? The once true pitbike class exploded and tempers flared (including mine). Before this, the rules were unspoken but known... if you build a 10" bike your gonna get smoked by the 12" bikes (I know... because it happened to me lol. I tried and tried to get a 10" class after I built my 50 but there was simply not enough riders. SO... I built a 12" full mod to compete). Its that simple... if your gonna race our open pitbike class... build a full mod cause your gonna need it. Now, its all screwed up.. and the scene that once was thriving has died. After the episodes in question, many people backed out of races around here including myself. Its not worth the toruble anymore. If it was up to me, it be the same way it has always been... build a 12" or under PIT bike youre happy with, bring it to the line and race. Its that simple.

 

Anyone sandbagging would get bumped a class higher.

I think that would keep the complaining way down.

 

Hell-- '05-'07, you opened any dirt bike mag, and it was FULL of pit bike ads. They were the rage. Now? At least here in Ohio, 12 inch Stock Mod is still going strong, along aith the trail bikes. 50's are around, but they've faded quite a bit. 12 inch Mod is still happening-- but nothing like it used to. The Vet classes have been pretty big-- hence the bigger trail bikes. If BBR backs up the new CRF110 with some cool products-- I'm thinking we could see an upswing.

Thing is-- the scene didn't fade because some guys showed up with 12 inch 150R's. Pit bikes in the mainstream were a fad of sorts. That-- and the economy sucking. With a crap economy-- peeps can't afford an $8000 mod, but they CAN afford a $1200 trail bike. --L*64

 

Thing is-- the scene didn't fade because some guys showed up with 12 inch 150R's.

Not sure if this was directed towards what I've said or not (none taken even if so), but I agree with this. I just was saying that I wish locals, everywhere, not just here, could help the sport grow again.

 

The scene was long dead before the whole ordeal, but i think the hostility to other ideas is what has killed it more than the oddball bikes, but seeing that J-720 is back we could have an upswing.

The few of us that are still here need to put something together and not point fingers at who did what, the fact is that it is really no ones fault other than the economy and that pitbikes have just lost the mainstream interest. If its gonna come back WE have to do something TOGETHER