TB manual clutch install problems...

4824 Views 47 Replies 8 Participants Last post by Z, Dec 6, 2004

velocity101

Discussion Starter · Nov 30, 2004

Shifts into gear like butter, but engaging the clutch handle doensn't disengage it from the gears. Was there a step I missed???

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Phat50s

· #2 · Nov 30, 2004

How long have you had it?

Contact Mike at Trail Bikes because his last shipment of kits was missing a few parts and he didn't know about it until they were shipped. Give him a call and he'll get the parts over to you ASAP (if that's what it is).

Was it one on the new 3 plates?

velocity101

Discussion Starter · #3 · Nov 30, 2004

Yeah, it's a 3-plate. I just got it in yesterday. When I ordered, Mike said that he wanted to hold off shipping mine until he got the missing parts (that were missing in orders prior) in ~ so I assumed he included everything with mine.

I just don't get why it's not disengaging... the install seemed pretty straight forward. Although, there is one piece that I'm unsure of; it's a washer with "OUT SIDE" enscribed on it. Do you guys know where it goes? I'm not new to working on my 50, but this is my first manual clutch install.

Thanks.

Z

· #4 · Nov 30, 2004

The washer with outside on it is important. It goes between clutch and the keeper on the crank that the nut that holds on the clutch attaches to.

Think of it this way. All slide on the crankshaft.

Clutch

"Outside" washer

Star Keeper (the one you bend the tabs down on)

4 prong clutch nut

Your washer plays an important role.

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velocity101

Discussion Starter · #5 · Nov 30, 2004

OIC, so do you think that the absense of this washer is what's keeping the clutch from disengaging?

Thanks, Z.

Z

· #6 · Nov 30, 2004

Did you install the gear on the clutch before you installed it on the crank?

Have you started your bike and ran it yet?

If I understand you correctly, you installed the clutch, and when you pull in the clutch lever, you can still kick over the bike?

It's extremely difficult to diagnose your issue without seeing the install and see what was done rigiht and wrong. Did you adjust the clutch screw to make sure you don't have too much free play?

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Pimpindahoes

· #7 · Nov 30, 2004

velocity....the diagram you PM'ed me about is for the two plate assembly. dont 100% sure if there is a difference but i will still snd that to you if you need it.

so your problem is that its like you dont have a clutch? can you pull in the clutch and bring the bike to a stop without it dying?you also could have mis-position the shift fork to where it wont lift the shift fork off the gears.

ill send the diagram regardless. once i get home from work.....i am pretty drunk right now too. went to black angus for some happy hour lunch with the boss. now i cant see straight and dont wanna work........workin had or hardly workin?

velocity101

Discussion Starter · #8 · Nov 30, 2004

This is the order I installed the clutch (excluding the primary and shift shaft):

- Collar

- guide bushing

- primary drive gear

- clutch center gear (not sure of name)

- clutch

I made sure that the clutch center gear seated into the clutch basket correctly as well as seated correctly onto the primary drive gear.

I have to start it in neutral. Kicking it into first gear kills the engine regardless of whether I've pulled the clutch handle in or not. I've adjusted the clutch adjuster screw in all positions... same results.

Question: Does all the pushrod do is push on the Oil Guide and Spring? How does it work in disengaging the clutch? Maybe that's where I'm having my problem...

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five0addict

· #9 · Nov 30, 2004

the cover gets pushed and that disengages it, just follow the directions look closely at the diagram, disassemble, and reassemble it.

Pimpindahoes

· #10 · Nov 30, 2004

maybe your screw is TOO far in...try to back it out some and until you find that point where it disengages its hit or miss.

tighten it down to where it will give some resitance to the kick starter. but it shouldnt be too easy to crank over. then you fine adjust from there. and also an FYI, if you are in gear or in neutral....the bike WILL NOT kick over....the clutch lever has to be dissengaged for it to kick over. thats one major downside to a clutch run off the crank and not the primary gear. try to back out the brass adjustment screw on the clutch perch........ sounds like your not gettin enough pull out of it.....if im reading you right.

and for some reason youve installed 5 things into your clutch....i had many more things than that when i did mine. but yuor probably leaving out the obvious.

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velocity101

Discussion Starter · #11 · Nov 30, 2004

Hmmm, so you're saying that it should NOT kick over without the clutch pulled in even if it's neutral? Mine does kick over in neutral... so maybe that's a clue as to what's going on. Mike and TB's just emailed me some diagrams, so I'm going to take a look at them.

Any other suggestions to check, please let me know...

kickstand13

· #12 · Nov 30, 2004

i installed my tb manuel cluch and it wil only start when you are in nuetral when you pull the clutch in and try to start it it will not have any compression and just sink down without you feeling anything......i dont really kno what your saying if this is it or not but

Pimpindahoes

· #13 · Nov 30, 2004

no if the clutch is pulled in it will have no compression....if the clutch is disengaged it will have compression.

since its a crank ran clutch this is normal. but i was talking about the amount of force needed to kick the bike over.....if its too easy that could be a problem and also if its too tight it will be very hard to kick over.......with a 88cc motor you should be able to kick it over with your hand. it shouldnt take much to kick it over but once you find the sweet spot youll know what im talking about...it cant grab too much and it cant grab too little.

with bike off. grab the kick lever with hand. push down not using a great amount of force. if it swings down too easy...tighten the srew inside the cover. if it takes some weight and muscle to get it to move down you will need to loosen it up a little.

but it sounds to me like youve mis-installed something r are missing something. take it apart and re-install using the supplied diagrams from mike. if tht doesnt work.....get in touch with mike and let him know. he will do more than necessary to handle you.

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velocity101

Discussion Starter · #14 · Dec 2, 2004

Okay, so I got the diagrams from Mike at TB ~ checked, quadruple checked everything. At most, while pulling the clutch in, I can roll the bike forward while in gear... but there is definitely resistence. I can feel it engage when I release the clutch lever. Cannot start the bike at all while in neutral (feels like it's not grabbing. Kickstarter goes limp).

Below are some pics. Can you see anything I've installed wrong? Maybe with the shifter?

Maybe I have the clutch plates wrong???

Or the clutch center?

I feel like an idiot... can't even get a basic manual clutch to work...

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3

Z

· #15 · Dec 2, 2004

I can see something wrong in the first picture. How can you change gears when the piece that grabs the shift star (top left corner) is behind it?

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velocity101

Discussion Starter · #16 · Dec 2, 2004

Doesn't it grab onto the tabs on the shift drum? It's how my Clymer manual shows it:

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Z

· #17 · Dec 2, 2004

If you can shift through the gears, then I'm looking at the picture wrong.

Z

· #18 · Dec 2, 2004

Underneath the gear on the crank, you have a bushing that can also be installed backwards and cause issues.. Did you reuse the bushing that camewith your auto, or did you use the TB one? They are different.

Did you soak the clutch in oil to make sure the plates aren't bound up? If the plates are dry, until you get the bike started and lubricate the clutch with oil, they can bind up causing you some headaches.

Keep your chin up, we'll get you sorted here before spring.

velocity101

Discussion Starter · #19 · Dec 2, 2004

I replaced the stock bushing with the new one that came with the kit. Installed it tapered towards the clutch.

I didn't soak the clutch plates in oil, but I did brush a coating of oil on each before installation. I guess it's worth a shot soaking them.

By spring? lol, you're a funny man, Z! I get grumpy if I don't get to ride for a week... my wife would have probably killed me by then.

Z

· #20 · Dec 2, 2004

Bringing this one to the top for all to read.

Install the clutch completely up to the point of putting the side cover on and take pictures again. I want to see what everything else looks like. Takee a picture of the backside of your assembled side case with the clutch mechanism too.

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