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If your bike is jetted properly, and your current coil isn't faulty, a coil swap won't make a bit of difference. A higher output coil can sometimes mask and work around mild mis-jetting, but don't count on it.
 

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Kurlon said:
If your bike is jetted properly, and your current coil isn't faulty, a coil swap won't make a bit of difference. A higher output coil can sometimes mask and work around mild mis-jetting, but don't count on it.






Is that true when using a modded motor..??? hotter spark is not better???
 

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You can actually degrade performance with too hot a spark. : )



You only need the spark to be hot enough to initiate a flame front, any more than that is extra strain for no gain. I have yet to hear of anyone hitting combustion pressures high enough that even a stock chinese coil can't generate a viable spark.
 

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Kurlon said:
You can actually degrade performance with too hot a spark. : )



You only need the spark to be hot enough to initiate a flame front, any more than that is extra strain for no gain. I have yet to hear of anyone hitting combustion pressures high enough that even a stock chinese coil can't generate a viable spark.




exactly.. i work in the performace car world and i get so sick of seeing people spend tons of money on aftermarket coils and ignition boxes on a car that's only making 215 horses... most of the time i just look at them and shake my head... then i show them how my car puts down 450+ HP on a stock ignition system... you only need more spark if you're generating enough cylinder pressure to "drown out" what the stock coil can produce. And most of the time it's the wires not transfering enough of the energy from the coil to the plug, not the coil lacking in power.
 

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Kurlon said:
What are your thoughts on Nology Hot wires while we're on the subject?




i like the Nology wires, although a little pricey they are a really good quality wire IMO. when i'm building an engine ( more especially a boosted one), I won't even start tuning untill there's either a set of nology or magnecore wires on it. They are the only 2 i've found that don't give up most of their performance after the first week or so of driving/tuning. I run magnecores on my car as they are a little cheaper and still perform really well. The grounding straps on the Nologys seem to be a bit excessive IMO , but it really does cut down on RF interferance.. you can litterally hear the difference through your radio when you strap them to ground, so at least you get a little proof that it's not just a gimmick



And although both companies say their wires are "waranteed" the reps at both will immediately start to blame you for the wire failure, weather it be some oil on them or whatever, they always have a way to make it "your fault"



but like i said, they are probably the 2 best wire manufacturers i've come across... whatever you do DON'T BUY ACCEL WIRES... they start to degrade from heat and lose quite a bit of conductivity after only a few days of hard use and exposure to high temps. I went through 3 sets in one week a long time ago trying to dial in a turbo civic hatch. after one day of tuning i'd go to do a final pull on the street and the motor would start missing and cutting out something fierce. but you could turn the boost down and it would run flawlessly. We got the replacement sets from accell the first 2 times and the same thing happened in about the same amount of time and heat cycles. I finally convinced the guy to spend the 90 bucks on some magnecores and the car never skipped a beat again. As a matter of fact that was 6 years ago and the car still has the same wires and is consistantly running 11.50's at the track while being a daily driver.
 

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As for coils, if you have an engine management system that will allow you to increase the charge time on them it usaully yields just as good of a result as switching to a more expensive set of coils or ignition box
 

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turboglenn said:
exactly.. i work in the performace car world and i get so sick of seeing people spend tons of money on aftermarket coils and ignition boxes on a car that's only making 215 horses... most of the time i just look at them and shake my head... then i show them how my car puts down 450+ HP on a stock ignition system... you only need more spark if you're generating enough cylinder pressure to "drown out" what the stock coil can produce. And most of the time it's the wires not transfering enough of the energy from the coil to the plug, not the coil lacking in power.


i runs msd on my car very happy w/it.. cold plugs and 250 shot of juice on a 303 f.i. injected motor and i like the results of hotter spark when using the juice and yes the car is street legal on motor is running 11.00s on the bottle is a complete diff animal!! as for the wires i do agree the better the wire the better the conductivity.

but i think the boys here are still talking about our minis ( engines)



glenn pm when you can i would like to send you a short clip of my 67 gto bro!!
 

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racerx... there's nothing wrong with MSD systems ( as a matter of fact i'm not far off from upgrading to a little better system myself ( because i'm about to add juice into the picture ) I was just saying that most of the time it's a waste to see people buy stuff like that thinking that they're going to see performance gains on a very mildly modded motor.



and yea, i guess we should stick tothe topic of minis here ( although the principals of an internal combusiton engine dont' change much wether it's a 1,4 or 8 cylinder motor, the concepts stay the same for the most part)



PM'ing you now for the goat vids * i love me some old muscle cars woohooo *
 
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The reason people believe things like this work is because they don't actually understand how the flame front is even started in an internal combustion engine. Its not a spark creating a flame like people think.
 

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Ok Cycle, are you subscribed to "Bling Mechanics Avatar of the Day Club" or what? : )



Anyways, you can't just pop into a nice techy thread, drop that little nugget, and run away to observe the head scratching from behind a camo duck blind. SHARE! : )



Doing some quick research...



E3 Spark Plugs

Yea, market speak! But I give them credit, the don't claim multiple spark kernels at a time ala Splitfire/etc. They just say the multiple electrodes keep the plug firing at peak longer. On the downside they claim over Mach 1 flame front propogation... isn't that definition of detonation in a gas motor?



Hrmmm... I've got nothing else, got distracted by a 'Plasma Ignition System' site's marketbabble and then realized I was at work and can't be surfing like this all day.
 

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cyclerider57 said:
The reason people believe things like this work is because they don't actually understand how the flame front is even started in an internal combustion engine. Its not a spark creating a flame like people think.


Alright Cycle, like Kurlon said dont leave us scratching lol, fill us in a least a little bit.
 
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Two questions before I get into it... Do you know what happens when lightening strikes? Did you know you can throw a lit match in a tank of gas and it won't ignite?
 

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As long as the match doesn't pass through a patch of air/gas vapor mix thats the right mixture and large enough to generate enough heat to ignite the nearby sub-optimal mixture... :p



As far as lightning, the basic idea is a large charge concentration begins to spill down from the clouds, creating an ion path. This ion path has lower resistance, which speeds up the process. The rapid flow heats the surounding air generating a proper plasma path with even lower resitance and then the bulk of the charge transfers. At least thats the theory as I recall it.
 
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